alleybaggett.net ~ View topic - Your Heart's Journal

Rank: Rookie Joined: 02 Feb 2005 Posts: 73

Alley,

How can you listen to all the propaganda?

First off, don't do research on the internet because anyone with two bit opinion can take bits and pieces of information and make it sound like it's the end of the world. If you want to do real research on global warming contact the Natural Science departments of Universities all over the world. Just e-mail them saying you want to know where you can find out information on global warming and our effects on it. Whether the professor believes we have an effect or not they can direct you to the best sources for information. You need at least 5- 10 different sources from different areas of the world, IMO, to make the best guess at what the truth is.

Second, DON"T SEE AN INCONVIENT TRUTH. Al Gore may be intelligent and have degrees in the field, but he also has an agenda and twist facts to support his view. For example, in the movie he states that the entire scientific community believes we are causing global warming. That is a half truth at best . a small portion believe we are the only cause, a large portion (myself included) believe we are some of the cause, but debate on how much, and a small portion believe we have no effect on it. He also states that the snow on Mt. Kilamajaro has decreaed over the last 30 years and, because of what his movie is about, implies it is due to global warming. In fact, it's main cause is due to deforestation. Finally, he forgets he was Vice President for 8 years. He has been yelling about this since before then. in the past 10 years, Brazil has converted from oil based economy to an ethanol based and this year is 100% free of oil imports. From my research, ethanol, although polluting, does not pollute as much as oil. He could have influenced a change over to that. Also why didn't support increased taxes for moving to the suburbs and reduced taxes for moving to the city? Also, what about tax credits for those who by high fuel economy cars or cities that improve or add Public transportation? He may have been Vice President, but he could have tried. He could have been on TV every day yelling about this, but chose not to.

Third, according to ice core samples in the North and South, the climate goes in cycles. for long periods of time winters may be mild, for other periods they may be outrageously cold. Around 1000 AD there was a small ice age that lasted for decades. Again in the early to mid 1800's things got very cold in certain areas for the winter and warm in other places. Example, Charles Dickens' a Christmas Carol has snow in London, because London had white Christmas' then. Now London has had maybe 3 over the past 100 years. Plus for the past 130+ years we have been taking day to day temperature readings, so our data is much more accurate that ice core samples.

Finally, I do believe we are contributing to global warming. From my research it is about 20%. The other 80 is natural. now if we don't try to limit our effect, that 20% will become larger. However the scare tactics of people like Al Gore are just as bad as those who would have us think we have no effect what so ever. The Al Gore's of the world want us to believe by the end of the century we will become Venus. This is not true. They try to say the increase in CO2 is due to cars and car plants over the past 50 years. They leave out that our population has more than double since then. Man breathes in O2 and out CO2. So we have doubled the output of CO2 into the atmosphere just from BREATHING alone. Yes, it doesn't match the car or factory outputs, but I'm trying to make a point that it all depends on whose reading the data.

I'm sorry if my rant offends anyone. And, Alley, I think it is great you want to clean up the environment. I have just traded in my gas-guzzler for a car that gets 32 MPG. I always grow a garden and add plants to my landscape every year. I am just fed up with the half truths on both sides. It's not one or the other - it's both. We are causing global warmin, we just aren't the only cause.

Thanks for reading my rant,
troyholc

Rank: Junior Member Joined: 18 Sep 2005 Posts: 147

ooooooooooooooo great!.............military talk, BOGUS! chya! Cool

Rank: Veteran Joined: 02 Feb 2005 Posts: 989

Great move Troy. Alley states her convictions and believes and you just slap her upside da head. Take 2 aspirin and watch Ghandi in the morning.
Shocked

Can't you just state your rebuttal without jabbing the messenger?
And how's that new propaganda car?

disclaimer: This has been an opinion. Any resemblence to actual facts is merely coincidence.

Rank: Rookie Joined: 07 Feb 2005 Posts: 53

Rank: Junior Member Joined: 08 Feb 2005 Posts: 141

This little fact I found recently really knocked the wind up me. It's printed on the back of my electricity bill.
http://img24.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=11659_3.5.06_150lo.jpg
It's nice to have the occasional "two handed" topic in here. I have more to add to this later, but in a nutshell, the idea of being energy conserving promotes resposibility and accountability in people, which are 2 virtues that seem to have less and less relevance in modern day western, consumption orientated culture. And it's good to hear from you Troy.

Rank: Total Noob Joined: 24 Feb 2005 Posts: 7

I remember when I was in graduate school in 1995 studying the various models about global warming. Reading up on some of the recent papers from friends still in Academia, alot of the models that countered the global warming effects have not panned out well, where as those models that showed global warming as an effect of human activity have predicted our current conditions better. My bet is that in another 10 years, the science community will have a better picture of how much we're screwing our planet.

As for the movie, it probably speculates alot, but it's not such a bad idea to get people to wake up and smell the shit now, then wake up when the shit is neck deep Twisted Evil

Official Model Joined: 15 Dec 2003 Posts: 2358

What I feel about global warming is this...You have to do something NOW to make things better for us and our loved ones. So many people are so self centered that they are so consumed with the now.....but what about the "you" in years to come? Why chance/play games or wonder about what is right and what's not right? You know what's right. You know the best thing to do is to turn off all the lights when you're not in a room (for example)....but so many people are SO lazy or just don't care. It's about morals, saving money and more importantly saving your health and the Earth's health!
Look I could go on and on....and I kind of feel like it...but then again....I don't really want to sound like I'm preaching or anything. I would like to end what I'm saying by stating that...I believe everyone should say to themselves "what if?" It really bothers me when some people are so narrow minded that they think....their way of thinking is the only/RIGHT way. I don't care how smart you "think" you are....The smarter ones are always the ones who ask....."what if?" and who give other possibilities a chance. That's how you find solutions to problems. Without this way of thinking we wouldn't have airplanes/ cars/ spacecraft and etc.

PEACE

Rank: Rookie Joined: 02 Feb 2005 Posts: 73

Maybe I didn't explain myself clearly. I have no issue with Alley wanting to help the environment. I want to help the environment. I just have issues with those who give absolutes. This is not an absolute issue. Unfortunately from some of the posts here it seems most care nothing for fact and only care to hear those that support their current opinion.

This is the last I will post about this.

troyholc

Rank: Senior Member Joined: 06 Mar 2005 Posts: 266

The earth on average has only warmed a fraction of a degree in the past 100 years. The earth is actually still and will be for a few thousands more years more coming out the last iceage. The earth will become more tropical and we will have less ice and snow. That's just a fact. Look at huricanes, floods and storms. Man kind can't stop mother nature. Despite anything we do the earth will warm up cus we will get closer to the sun. The glorious thing is this is the United States and technically we can say anthing we want. Unfortunately that's not true. I don't like were are country is headed. I hate political correctness. I don't care if folks get offended. Life is hard and sucks sometimes. If a kid gets sick from a cold he might die now a days. It's because he hasn't being exposed to diseases. Same thing with the environment you can't shelter yourself from reality. Not everyone has to get along,...we don't all have to love each other and you don't have to like everyones lifestyle. This country needs more of a little let live. I think we were alot better off 60 years ago rather than today.

Rank: Casual Joined: 18 Mar 2005 Posts: 11

Rank: Total Noob Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 6

Hi Alley,

Im basically a Product Designer at university (in England) and a recent project we did was about energy awareness and its scary some of the facts that are coming out. I think its wrong to look at things on the internet and not believe them even though alot of it is just pure junk.

The thing is though, what i found to be rather potent was the fact that within Europe and Asia, there seems to be a real push for enery conservation but the developing countries such as China and India are creating larger and larger carbon footprints.

An encouraging thing ive found and one thing (im nor are us eurpoeans, anti-american or anything) that the US in particular may struggle to cope with is the lack of oil, something that within our society is taken for granted. Its used in pretty much everything around us and the pure fact of the matter is that without this, industries will break down and of course America dont seem to want to accept this fact.

Energy awareness is a massive project and the unfortunate irony of this is that awareness doesnt really exist. Our project was to create a product which enhanced energy awareness and the thing is, most of our ideas came down to educational pallets and booklets that are free and given to the youth becasue learning energy awareness and oil consumption and how it effects the environment at such a young age will provide a much more significant impact then telling someone your on age - im 20- that its a problem. You see as adults, we see things thorugh cost and value whereas a kid will see things through interest and belief rather than anything else.

Education itself is a product because, look around the internet for anything energy efficient and you'll find it...but using it is another thing. Goverments - Kyoto agreement which incidently, the US is yet to sign too because of the STRICT rules - and education are the strongest product we have at our disposle and its dissapointing to see such lack of information and incentive from people to educate others in the US and other parts of the world. The UK and most of Europe provide classes, workshops and seminars on this subject and theres even a course at some universities dedicated to this.

and unfortunately, its people like the guy who started this project that dont know about this oil problem. Oil will run out - it is finite so limiting our affect is much more significant than ever. Trading your gass-guzzling car isnt really doing anything, but riding your bike to work or walking will do something because sooner or later there will be no more oil.

Global warming is caused by carbon emissions which coincide with the use, production of crude oil and the fact its running out means at sometime, you wont have it so think to yourself, what will life be like without Oil, petrol, diesel?

The earth only needs to change by three degrees to be life threatning and the invention of engines and most production techniques started in the early 20th century and only increased...

Oil is the main culprit of global warming and in a way. i'll be glad to see it run out...but what will be left of our oil-driven and hungry society?

What kind of world will we leave for our environment if any...

Rank: Veteran Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 837

I read the journal and I think it's great that we are all contributing to global warming. Exactly how much I don't know but we can at least work on ways to protect the only Earth we have. I think change is needed now rather than later in our choices for energy if we are to survive in the 21st century. I haven't seen An Inconvient Truth yet but hopefully they'll show it in my neck of the woods soon so that I may check it out for myself.

Thank you for posting this journal entry and releasing your thoughts unto us, Alley. Hopefully, we will be able to return the favor and "release" something unto you too!!! Wink

Rank: Veteran Joined: 02 Feb 2005 Posts: 989

Rank: Veteran Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 837

I just re-read what I wrote, especially the first sentence. Obviously I don't think it's GREAT that we're all contributing to global warming. Embarassed

What I meant to say was that I think that we're all contributing to global warming. I was going to type something else but changed my thoughts in mid-stream and forgot to fully erase my earlier sentence. I don't want Alley thinking I'm pro-global warming!!! Laughing

Rank: Veteran Joined: 02 Feb 2005 Posts: 989

I'm glad you explained yourself, Tyger. Had Alley read your comment, she would have put you on her "does not exist anymore" list.

I hope you don't expect me to undo my ROFLMAO yesterday after reading your comment. Very Happy